Open mike 20/11/2013

Written By: notices and features - Date published: - 226 comments
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226 comments on “Open mike 20/11/2013”

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  1. 1

    I probably wouldnt jump for joy at BE’s announcement that there will be no more asset sales.

    There are other ways to skin a cat.

    One is to shut down a state owned company and pass on its work to the private sector, ie Learning Media.
    Two is to have the company sell off its assets bit by bit, ie KiwiRail selling the Hillside foundry and AgResearch and Landcorp their farms.
    Or you could do what Solid Energy does and contract out the operation of its mines to the private sector, so they are pretty much privately run anyway.

    1. 1.1

      Or simply run it down and provide a completely crap service to such an extent people give up on it and go private – think EQC in Christchurch. Absolutely abysmal and rage-inducing. So much so that many people who work for them have been subjected to personal abused outside of their work which has had other effects within our small communities.

      The history of the Christchurch recovery by Brownlee and his band of goons is well painted by now and I don’t think the history books will be kind to him.

  2. 2

    Boris comes to the rescue of the super-rich!

    The Let Down tenants echo the Occupy movement, which for a brief moment reminded us all that the banks have probably cost us more through the crash, subsidies and tax avoidance than they have contributed in tax revenues. Wealth trickles up to the 1%, not the other way around.

    The rich are the ones that cause poverty through their financial system that rewards being rich and punishes working hard.

    1. 2.1

      which for a brief moment reminded us all that the banks have probably cost us more through the crash, subsidies and tax avoidance than they have contributed in tax revenues.

      These guys need to get with the programme. Between 2008-2010 the banks lost more money than they had made in their entire history. A clear sign that their record profits in the ten years leading up to the GFC were entire illusory – or fraudulent.

    1. 3.1

      Yep – Maori TV News at 7pm (with subtitles for those who don’t know te reo) is a “must view” – especially on the mining and drilling issues, and the land issues which are still a problem for Maori today …… despite Waitangi T. settlements. Another side of Aotearoa many of us don’t see.

  4. 4

    When selling off 20% of Air NZ, wouldn’t you have to balance the books by subtracting the cost of buying the airline in the first place against the “profit” of the sale this week?

    1. 4.1

      You are turning an asset on your balance sheet (the ownership stake) into cash. So no.

      BTW this is similar to what all private sector companies do when they run down recently purchased public assets. They slowly degrade the assets or get rid of them, transforming the balance sheet into cash that they distribute to themselves.

      1. 4.1.1

        Tranzrail be one of the best examples, when “Sir” Michael Fay put the order to the GM to haul all possible cash out and do nothing about maintenance and upgrade.

        Scum

    1. 5.1

      On the other hand it could have the opposite effect? The kiss of death like sports commentators saying the team cannot loose this match from here.

      1. 5.1.1

        Key has already told the party elite he wants out. He was forced to stay. This isn’t Key’s wish. This is his worst nightmare! Someone up there hates him.

      2. 5.2.2

        I liked the other joke: ” He promised that the next time Mr Key visited, he would get a book on his own visit – although the laughter indicated he wasn’t necessarily telling the truth.”

    1. 7.1

      Walmart only made US$3.70B dollars last financial quarter. If they were to give every one of their “associates” a $25 Thanksgiving voucher they might go broke…

      (2M employees = $50M cost, = US$0.05B reduction in profit for the quarter = unacceptable)

      1. 7.1.1

        Where did you get that stat? The linked article says that in 2012, Wal-Mart’s profit was $15.7b.

        Or are they going down hill fast? And a drop to $3.65b profit means they will go broke?

            1. 7.1.1.1.1.1

              Also the Walton family collectively are personally worth $100B or more = the same wealth as the bottom 50M or so Americans.

              1. 7.1.1.1.1.1.1

                That is where it starts to get a bit murky: wealth is carried in all forms, not just money…..land, art, property, shares, bonds etc.The basic principle is to prevent abnormal accumulation and to redistribute wealth. There are some basic contradictions here…capital is required for investment / reinvestment, so it helps if it accumulates (unless we find a better way of funding enterprise). If we tax the capital we also get into an investment prevention conundrum.

                I don’t see the Waltons as much as a rich in liquid terms (they might be but who knows), but what they have is enormous control and consequently power. It does not appear healthy for any society for any small group to have outrageous power and influence.

                1. 7.1.1.1.1.1.1.1

                  There are some basic contradictions here…capital is required for investment / reinvestment

                  However, a lot of the uberwealthy aren’t using this capital for investment/reinvestment in productive ways. They are investing in paper financial assets and real estate, for instance, helping to fuel speculative bubbles but creating fuck all jobs. The classic example is JP Morgan. This bank currently holds US$50B in excess reserves at the Federal Reserve, collecting a couple of billion a year in interest.

                  You would think that the job of a bank would be to loan this excess money out to corporations and SMEs so that they could invest/re-invest in their enterprises.

                  But no, it’s easier just to take the interest free ticket clip, especially when there is no expectation of economic growth or increased consumer spending in western countries any time soon.

                  If we tax the capital we also get into an investment prevention conundrum.

                  How so? Is building a hydrodam, an electrified train network, researching the next generation of wood processing technologies not “investment”? These are all things which can be done by the tax dollar, and particularly in areas that the private sector aren’t interested in because the payoff cannot be easily and quickly extracted.

                  It does not appear healthy for any society for any small group to have outrageous power and influence.

                  At the level of wealth they have, they can, and do, challenge sovereign governments in order to further their own private interests.

                  1. 7.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1

                    Yes the ultra wealthy don’t reinvest in the US or here……maybe, I suspect they do. The job problem in the first world in probably got something to do with under-investment…Marx among others predicted the diminishing rates of return / profit. More recently this problem gets addressed by offshoring production to the third world etc. That of course does not last.

                    Then the lack of investment despite bank “deposits”…borrowing is at record lows but there are few takers, profits are ltoo low and risk is too high…for both lender and borrower. What a mess. As you say it stays in the bank but something has to pay the interest…usually more debt created out of thin air.

                    I don’t think spending tax dollars on infrastructure from a diminishing tax base is very useful when it wont lead directly to real investment in consumption, which in turn will drop the tax base. It is the classic problem with Keynes, he got away with it by virtue of cheap expanding energy supply.

                    No easy answers, what I do think though is that if we can minimize the disparities of wealth retention between top and bottom we are in a better position.

                    1. 7.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1

                      The job problem in the first world in probably got something to do with under-investment…Marx among others predicted the diminishing rates of return / profit. More recently this problem gets addressed by offshoring production to the third world etc. That of course does not last.

                      The job problem is the critical one to analyse IMO. We are not getting it right and the result is destroying our social capital and our people in the process. As a society we are missing out on the valuable output of creativity and production that we could be enjoying from these under utilised people (the so-called “output gap”).

                      Offshoring production to the third world has done little for the global economy other than to shift income share away from workers towards owners in an exercise of wage arbitrage. Yes us privileged types in the western world who still have strong incomes get the benefits of product/service price deflation (how on earth you can make and ship a 42″ LCD TV for $300 wholesale is beyond me but apparently it can be done) but that lovely price deflation comes at the cost of income deflation to a lot of workers who lost decent paying jobs.

                      And then this is the kicker: we’re talking about insufficient paid employment in society. Yet when we look around there is shit loads of work which society needs to get done, which we would all benefit from, but which is not being done. And then there are a lot of unemployed and underemployed people.

                      So we end up with this situation: a lot of useful, beneficial, productive work for society which could be done. A lot of motivated, capable people who want to enter work, or go from part time work to full time work.

                      And a political economic system which is so fucked up, it can’t put one and one together to make two – and in some instances, actually thinks that it is a good thing that good people rot in unemployment (as a buffer stock to control inflation, keep wages low, etc).

        2. 7.1.1.2

          are they going down hill fast?
          Maybe the cuts to food stamps is cutting sales?

          Not that it should make paying wages any harder seeing as the staff salary is so low the staff are on food stamps too… the cut in food stamps means their pay has gone down hence the charity drive.

          The majority of Walmart employees reportedly make less than $25,000 annually, and many of them rely on food stamps. A case study compiled by the Democratic staff of the House Committee on Education and the Workforce found that employees in one Walmart location received between $96,007 and $219,528 in food stamps over the course of a single year.

          When are people going to realise that a corporation like this os not doing them a favour when they hire them?

          1. 7.1.1.2.1

            Another example of a corporation using tax payers money to subsidise its low wages and boost its own profits. Like our McDonalds in NZ.

  8. 8

    Wow, we made $ 365 million with AIRNZ. Here is my comparison with some other lump sumps floating around out there such as the $ 13 Billion JP Morgan has to pay in fines for it’s role in the 2008 mortgage scam and the illegal foreclosures which cots thousands of Americans their homes.

    1. 8.1

      $13 billion….hmmm small change compared to the scams….a mere trifle. Also, JPs are banksters, they probably paid by doing some fractional money creation….another scam.

    1. 9.1

      That type of move is, quite simply, psychopathic.

      There’s nothing wrong with living in a state house for life.

          1. 9.1.1.1.1

            it’s pretty basic to the hierarchy of needs. Security of shelter, makes a great difference to a range of behaviours unhelpful to society overall.

            1. 9.1.1.1.1.1

              If you can afford to rent or pay a mortgage then you shouldn’t be in a state house because there are other families or people worse off who need the accomadation

              Is this unreasonable?

              1. 9.1.1.1.1.1.1

                Yes.
                It is grossly unreasonable that there is a shortage of state houses.

                It is unreasonable to give tax cuts to the rich and then kick people out of their homes so the poor can scramble over the crumbs that remain.

                    1. 9.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1

                      Alien concept to him.

                      When considering other people, tories are compelled to make decisions based on the cold logic of necessity, even when it’s not actually necessary.

  10. 10

    McDonald’s continues to give advice to it’s employees about how to live in poverty:

    Elsewhere on the site, McDonald’s encourages its employees to break apart food when they eat meals, as “breaking food into pieces often results in eating less and still feeling full.” And if they are struggling to stock their shelves with food in the first place, the company offers assistance for workers applying for food stamps.

    If a business can’t afford to pay their workers enough so that they aren’t living in poverty then that business should close.

            1. 10.1.1.1.1.1

              Yeah and McDonalds can go get lost. Fast food chains do nothing but destroy environments (palm oil production/loss of native forest/loss of food sources and livelihoods to those who live in them and loss of wildlife) destroy workplace well being and job security and create health problems (if their products are consumed in excess)

              Instead for ultimate nutrition and happiness for everyone:

              Remove GST off everything but if it has to be just one essential, take it off all food

              Abandon the global corporate food model – we are it’s slaves, not its customers.

              Re introduce large scale food production co-ops and in turn introduce large scale grocery retail co-ops to challenge the supermarket industry.

              Uncover questionable practices in the supermarket industry and regulate so that suppliers and customers aren’t disadvantaged.

              Review food safety standards and improve where necessary. Bring in G.E food labelling

              No more advertising nonsense (eg, Countdown feed four for $15)about “food on a budget”, Time we moved on from WW2 mind sets about decent food availability. No one should have to scrimp and save for an essential.

              Finally if there’s a special occasion, a birthday, anniversary or celebration everyone has the means, due to afforable housing, food, bills and having well paid jobs, to go a decent restaurant if they chose to.

              Rosie’s food for all mandate. Not brought to you by Fonterra, Unilever, Nestle or anyone else.

  11. 11

    I thought I would check out how shares in our partially sold assets were going today.

    Well ….

    Air NZ shares have dropped so far today from $1.65 at opening to $1.580* … with a massive 34 million shares traded in 498 transactions. The big players are having a field day.

    * now up slightly to $1.60

    Meanwhile:

    Meridian – oh dear. Having opened at $1.02, they are down to $0.995. Think this is the first time they have fallen below one dollar. .

    And MRP – opened at $2.15, now $2.10

    EDIT

    The Herald on the Air NZ price drop

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=11160102

    and Meridian

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=11160157

      1. 11.1.1

        Depress the share price further so that Government can buy the shares back at a profit (it’s the free market way).

  13. 13

    Another day, another right-wing hero exposed for what he really is …

    Allan Titford has been convicted of multiple crimes, including rape and arson.

    Allan who? Google the name, and check out the websites cheerleading for him … “One New Zealand” (sic), E-local (a nasty rag, in your mailbox), “one law for all” (sounds familiar, Brash-fans?).

    He’s the hero of 3 a.m. talkback saddoes and Kiwiblog t/rolls – the kind that pop up here all too often. They must be proud today.

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/9421979/Titford-sentenced-on-rape-and-arson-charges

    2. 13.2

      urgh. Nice guy 🙁

      Titford is being sentenced in the Whangarei District Court today after he was convicted by a jury on 14 charges of assault with a weapon, seven of assault, four of male assaults female, three of assault on a child, three of sexual violation, two of arson, and single charges of using a document with intention to defraud, threatening to kill, assault using a weapon, perjury, attempting to pervert the course of justice and discharging a firearm.

      The sexual offences were committed against his former wife Susan Cochrane who in an unusual step waived her right for name suppression so Titford could be named.
      […]
      His former wife Susan read her victim impact statement to the court, saying Titford had kept her “as a slave” for 22 years.

      3 News:

      In a victim impact statement read to the court, Ms Cochrane said she had been kept as a slave by Titford for 22 years, and was a victim of his sexual offences.
      Ms Cochrane was diagnosed with depression in 1995 and had thought of committing suicide numerous times over the last 20 years. But a “special bond” with her children stopped her.

      Read more: http://www.3news.co.nz/Northland-sex-criminal-jailed/tabid/423/articleID/322115/Default.aspx#ixzz2l9Taa2e2

      The Maori Land dispute: – which Titford is bitter about and claims he was treated unfairly.

      RNZ calls it rape:

      At the High Court in Whangarei, he was sentenced to 16 years’ jail on rape charges and violent assaults on his wife. Judge Duncan Harvey said he had subjected his wife and family to repeated violent abuse in a reign of terror that dated back to 1989.

      The court heard victim impact statements from his former wife, Susan Cochrane, and three of his children who said they had lived in fear of daily beatings from Titford and were made to work like slaves on the farm.

      Titford is well-known for his 20-year campaign against the Waitangi Tribunal and the Treaty of Waitangi after the Roroa land claim led to the sale of his farm to the Crown in the 1990s.
      He was also found guilty of burning down his homestead at Maunganui Bluff – an arson he blamed at the time on Maori.

      Judge Harvey said Titford attempted to gain sympathy with the public by sabotaging his own bulldozer and burning down the homestead in a bid to gain more compensation from the Government.

      “You attempted to burn down your homestead on one occasion, and on the second occasion you succeeded – all the while by blaming local Maori.

      “These incidents received nation-wide publicity and, as a result of your actions, the local Maori people earned the anger of many people in New Zealand who sympathised with you because of what they saw as a grave injustice. It is time for the people of New Zealand to learn the truth.”

      2. 13.2.2

        the local Maori people earned the anger of many people in New Zealand who sympathised with you because of what they saw as a grave injustice. It is time for the people of New Zealand to learn the truth.”

        His supporters included (former) ACT people like Muriel Newman, and local newspaper editors.

        Time for some major apologies.

          1. 13.2.2.1.1

            Incredibly dignified and restrained comments by local Maori (Nathan? didn’t catch) on RNZ Checkpoint.

            It should be compulsory listening for every bigot who has been regurgitating anti-Maori poison – and the media who played their part in ignoring the REAL story, and were scratching the Orewa race itch instead.

            And we’re only learning the truth because his ex-wife chose to lift name suppression. She has more courage than a hundred right-wing bloggers and ranters.

      3. 13.2.3

        Radio NZ news bulletins today have continually referred to Titford as “the anti-Treaty activist”. Fact is: he is an anti-Māori activist, a fervent hater of Māori culture, and a dyed-in-the-wool racist. His supporters have included such notorious race-baiters as John Ansell, Muriel Newman, Rodney Hide, Paul Holmes and Kyle Chapman.

        Yet Radio NZ keeps referring to Titford as if he is some kind of political thinker, rather than a crude and violent bigot. I guess the script that these hapless newsreaders are obliged to follow is written by the same person who instructs Radio NZ newsreaders to describe the bloodthirsty S.S. leader Garth “The Knife” McVicar as a “victims’ advocate”.

        2. 13.2.3.2

          While I recognise the point you’re making, Moz, Radio NZ were correct. He was an activist against the treaty. His motivation may have been racist, but that description is quite literally the fact of the matter.

          Glad to see him gone though, and thanks for reminding of us of the names of his smug and supine supporters who I hope are all cringeing at what their backing of him actually allowed him to get away with.

          1. 13.2.3.2.1

            He was an activist against the treaty. His motivation may have been racist, but that description is quite literally the fact of the matter.

            You are, strictly speaking, correct. However, to credit his violent and relentless hatred of Māori as political is like crediting Kyle Chapman as a political analyst, or Garth McVicar as a justice analyst, or science-denier Leighton Smith—another Titford supporter by the way—as a science analyst. All of these are true, in a narrow sense.

            Equally, I am an automobile expert, because I can inflate a tyre and pump in gas occasionally.

              1. 13.2.3.2.1.1.1

                I don’t see anyone calling him an expert or an analyst.

                He was treated as a noble, persecuted battler by (amongst others) North and South magazine, Paul Holmes, ACT, the National Party, numerous sympathetic television interviewers and the New Zealand Herald. His choleric and ignorant opinions were treated with respect and sympathy; while Titford lacks the polish and the social cachet of people like Michael Bassett and David Round, his “analysis” was, and is, about as rigorous as theirs.

                Yesterday’s hourly repetition (on Radio NZ) that he is an “anti-Treaty activist” only further adds to the misleading perception of this violent, cynical, racist criminal.

                1. 13.2.3.2.1.1.1.1

                  Still, I don’t see anyone calling him either of the words you chose.

                  Fact is he is an activist. Whether you or I agree with his activism is neither here nor there.

                  1. 13.2.3.2.1.1.1.1.1

                    Still, I don’t see anyone calling him either of the words you chose.

                    Fair enought, felix. You are correct. Maybe I mistook Titford for one of his rabid supporters, like Muriel Newman or Michael Bassett or Rodney Hide, all of whom speak like him, and all of whom ARE treated with (entirely unwarranted) respect.

                    Fact is he is an activist. Whether you or I agree with his activism is neither here nor there.

                    He’s an arsonist, first and foremost.

        3. 13.2.3.3

          I agree with you. Titford is a racist anti-Maori activist who uses redneck dissatisfaction with the Treaty as a tool. He is absolute scum and lucky that Te Roroa are very gentle people. He was a Kyle Chapman in gumboots, with an unhealthy dash of sex criminal in the mix.

          1. 13.2.3.3.1

            Titford is a racist anti-Maori activist who uses redneck [sic] dissatisfaction with the Treaty as a tool.

            Murray, I love your description of Titford as “Kyle Chapman in gumboots”!

            But please avoid abusing the term “redneck” by applying it to people like Allan Titford. Many hard-working and enlightened outdoor workers and farmers are thoughtful and intelligent people; the term you should use is “bigot” or “racist” or “reactionary” or “National Party supporter”.

            Most of the really vile racists who infest our media—Larry “Lackwit” Williams, Leighton Smith, Michael Laws, Sean Plunket, Kerre McIvor, John Ansell, Nevil “Breivik” Gibson, Garth The Knife McVicar, David Round, Michael Bassett, Muriel Newman, Rodney Hide—enjoy indoor employment with no danger of physical harm, and minimal or zero responsibility. Other than Smith, who occasionally potters around in his vineyard, not one of them has a red neck from working outside.

      1. 13.3.1

        That’s called ‘chutzpa’…..explained in terms of someone in the U.S.A.who had just been convicted of murder… after killing his parents but whose lawyer asked the judge for leniency because he was now an orphan.

    1. 14.1

      Yes it does adam. Independent food production, in agriculture especially is becoming more of a threat to the global corporate food giants as this method of production gains popularity. It would seem, that corporates have a level of control over govt regulation. Hows that for a surprise! Corporates influencing govt!

      Whats the bet that something like the Canadian equivalent of Fonterra (and I wonder does Fonterra in fact have a stake in the Canadian market?) are behind that influence in this case. Maybe not overtly, but they will be there.

  16. 16

    Remember when Health was the portfolio that always hurt the government? Annette King is just making no impact at all on Ryall. She is looking exasperated.

    1. 16.1

      Agree, King needed to go when clark did. She was health minister so it’s an epic fail on her.

      plenty of material such as the way shifty has played with the wait lists via reclassification and done the classic money to private but risk stays public.

      It requires effort to get it and discretion as health’s a small area with gov’t as the single employer virtually….there’s the issue, she’s past it let someone fresh like David Clark at it.

      DC will reshuffle, gotta give the old guard a chance, respect for your elders etc

      1. 16.1.1

        ..and doesn’t Shearer look so much more comfortable in Foreign Affairs.

  17. 17

    Name suppression didnt defeat the rumour mill up north. Did wail slick breach the suppression order to protect the women and children of the north??

    1. 17.1

      He already got fined for showing the suppression orders to be a farce, didn’t see anyone from the left dipping into their pockets to make the same point

  18. 18

    Michelle Boag refers to the Legatum Institute praising our country…to suggest that no-one should be complaining about the state of New Zealand. The mentions Kazakhstan by comparison..saying we have nothing to complain about compared to them.
    Mora fails again to question this strawman argument as usual…

    1. 18.1

      It is also significant that she chose Kazakhstan as her example of a country where children fear being bombed. Of course, a more obvious and more appropriate example would have been Pakistan, Afghanistan, Iraq, Yemen or Palestine. But Boag, being the right wing ideologue that she is, would never ever make that mistake; she quite cleverly kept the implied criticism to an official foe—Russia.

      Unfortunately, while she is clever and always on the job, Brian Edwards and Jim Mora are neither; they simply let her comment go unchallenged and unmodified.

  19. 19

    Man beats sister for being an ‘egg’
    by JIMMY ELLINGHAM

    When he thought his sister was being an “egg”, a Palmerston North beneficiary hit her in the face. On October 14, Michael Walker, 25, was at home, where he lived with his mother, sister and nephew.

    When Walker and his sister argued over cleaning their mum’s vehicle, he went to the car, pulled out the car jack and smashed a window. His sister confronted him and he punched her in the face three times.

    “He stated his sister was being an egg but then refused to explain his actions,” police prosecutor Sergeant Stu Oram told the Palmerston North District Court yesterday.

    Walker admitted charges of assault and wilful damage.

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/9421303/Man-hits-sister-for-being-an-egg

    1. 21.1

      The should just begin to quietly reacquire the shares cheaper, announcing at the last moment that they are doing so causing a rapid price spike, ensuring that the Government’s stake is worth more than ever before.

      Or maybe I’m talking about what Goldman Sachs would do.

  22. 22

    Holy shit! Waitakere electorate gets split into Upper Harbour & Kelston – Would Bennett be Kelston? That would most likely be my electorate!

            1. 22.1.1.1.1.1

              Maybe it goes down Te Atatu Rd, on second look, Not Hepburn. Still looks small, but lots of big households there due to economic constraints.

              I see lots of grown kids moving back home or families moving back together, one house at $600 pw rent is better than two at $420. Three generation families..

              Avondale and the sea side of Kelston are very popular with young families, still reasonably priced in Auckland with estuary views and close to transport.

              I miss the smell of the mangroves..

    2. 22.2

      Nats bright idea to gift the new Auckland seat to Colin Craig looks to be in a bit of trouble. TV3 is reporting that Bennett has called a crisis meeting of her electorate officials.

      1. 22.2.1

        Colin Craig in as MP with 4% of the vote and Bennett loses her seat and goes in as a list MP…not bad (for National :))

        1. 22.2.1.1

          Except that the new Upper Harbour seat looks like a marginal at best for both National and Labour and likely to be Labour leaning in a swing year (which next year could easily be).Its a pretty dodgy prospect for them if they want to ensure that Craig wins a seat. So that leaves them with the option of turfing out a sitting Nat MP in a North Shore seat to accommodate Craig and so it gets messy. As for Bennett, sure she could go in on the list but losing her Westie base would be a pretty big blow.

          1. 22.2.1.1.1

            McCully moves onto the list and Craig runs in East Coast Bays:

            “East Coast Bays is also home to the City Impact Church, a multi-million dollar operation run by senior pastor Peter Mortlock and a potential Christian power-base for the Conservatives.”

            Sounds like a good play by National to do this

            1. 22.2.1.1.1.1

              That’s the most likely outcome. The only problem for Key is that it leaves him open to attack that he’s so desperate to get elected next year he’s prepared to turf out a sitting Nat MP.

              1. 22.2.1.1.1.1.1

                …and smuggle in a truly weird fundy who makes Key’s last neanderthal toy-boy John Banks seem like a normal 21st century kiwi.

                Desperate indeed.

    3. 22.3

      She’ll want to go for Upper Harbour. So much for her Westie claims. On the other hand she may be told she can’t have it. Reserved for ‘The Teeth’ (Colin Craig) . She’ll have to go on the list. Poor wee Benny girl. My heart bleeds for her.

          1. 22.3.1.1.1

            Actors aren’t actually the characters they play, though. Sheryl West was the Westie. Where Robyn Malcolm came from was irrelevant. Paula pretends she is the character she plays. If they decided to give her Epsom, she’d start eating cucumber sandwiches.

      1. 23.1.1

        Chris is just running desperate distraction because he doesn’t want to talk about Titford and his right-wing fan club.

      2. 23.1.2

        Fuck you asshole, it was in the Chch Press (yeah the paper edition) today…solo mum and bene buys 7 grand car so the welfare system can’t be too shabby huh

        1. 23.1.2.1

          Or maybe you’ve read it on Whalespew, that truthful and reliable news source for right wing idjits, who ironically, is a beneficiary himself.

          1. 23.1.2.1.1

            The fuck part of “in the Chch Press (yeah the paper edition) today” don’t you understand? Solo mum/bene has the money to buy a 7 grand car so she can obviously manage her finances enough to not only live on but also buy her dream car

          1. 23.1.2.2.1

            So what? The solo mum can buy a (more than) decent car on the money shes given so isn’t that the main thing…oh sorry it doesn’t play into the “living wage” garbage

        3. 23.1.2.3

          Have you tried to buy a second hand car lately? It took me a month or two to get my latest one. Old cars are not as cheap as they once were, and there’s not a lot going. In terms of reliability, it’s probably not worth buying anything much under $5-6 thou – and that’s taking a chance.

            2. 23.1.2.3.1.2

              chris73, when you come up with 4,5000 more cases of car buying sprees, please let us know as it will equal the social welfare for Rio Tinto.

              1. 23.1.2.3.1.2.1

                So why not go down to the smelter and tell the workers why it was a bad idea and see what reception you get?

                However its a nice attempted distraction from the main point which is a solo mum on a benefit manages to buy a 7 grand car when all you hear from labour/greens is some whining and bleating about how bad the benes have it

                1. 23.1.2.3.1.2.1.1

                  So have you come up with another 4,500 similar cases yet chris73?

                  So why not go down to the smelter and tell the workers why it was a bad idea and see what reception you get?

                  Sounds like you are making the case for government stepping in and keeping more industry alive in NZ?

                  I’d back that.

                2. 23.1.2.3.1.2.1.2

                  I’m absolutely disgusted that society is providing a mother and her children with a modest, reasonable vehicle.

                  What’s wrong with this country? Next we’ll learn they didn’t have noodles for dinner every night last week.

                  1. 23.1.2.3.1.2.1.2.1

                    Thats funny I’m absolutely stoked that a solo mom on a benefit can afford her dream car, it shows that National are quite generous whereas the looney left would have you believe National are miserly

                    Which is why John Key will be returned to power

                    1. 23.1.2.3.1.2.1.2.1.1

                      one $7000 car per ten years is cheaper than one $3,500 car per five years, if you knew anything about living on nothing.

                      what a shit dumb story.

                      tell me chris73, how much did the average horse cost, as a chunk of wages, before cars came along?

                    2. 23.1.2.3.1.2.1.2.1.2

                      “it shows that National are quite generous whereas the looney left would have you believe National are miserly”

                      Ah I see. So if I find one example of a rich guy with a nice car that would prove that taxes are still way too low.

                      Got it.

            3. 23.1.2.3.1.3

              Benes shouldn’t have dreams or be ashperashunal. They aren’t even allowed chocolate biscuits when belts are being tightened. And they should know their place, head down, over a bucket probably.

              Given a chance to run down someone on a benefit without knowing all the details, the average RW will push any facts or understanding aside. Everybody knows that benes are not playing ‘The Game’ and get into an opposition huddle all turning and spitting at the same time. It leaves watchers on the left gobsmacked.

        4. 23.1.2.4

          Maybe a NAct cabinet minister paid her off for not taking a sexual harassment case against him? Of course, I have as much evidence for this as you do for your version, but why worry about facts when we can take our prejudices for a walk?

          What the story does show is that NAct voting car dealers are scum, following the moral and ethical prescriptions of your leader.

        5. 23.1.2.5

          Beautiful to watch Piss73 under pressure and getting all hoha.

          Try living the life which comes with the bennie in the vast majority of cases, Piss arsehole you saviour of all that is right and proper.

          Would be a richly deserved case of Tit-For-Tat-Ford.

    2. 23.2

      Yes, our generous tax payer donation of $ 1.7 billion to South Canterbury Finance was a bit ott, wasn’t it?
      Got a comment on that..or are you bene bashing over 7k
      Just wondering…..

      1. 23.2.1

        I don’t think labour or National should have done what they did, I think they should have been left to go under and rather then bashing benes I’m praising National for being as generous as they are…as should you lot

        Left debating 101: Ignore the main point and try to refocus the arguement on a different matter

        1. 23.2.1.1

          Who cares what you think chris73, the party you support pulled together $1.7B for rich SCF investors no probs yet $3M for dead workers families and its deep pockets short arms syndrome.

          1. 23.2.1.1.1

            left debating tactic: emotional arguments are used when failing to argue case

            This is about how generous National are to benes ie they can afford to buy decent cars

            What National is or isn’t doing for the miners families is a seperate issue, which you are more then welcome to start a thread about but has no relevance here

              1. 23.2.1.1.1.1.1

                I’m not bashing benes (although her utter stupidity does make it tempting) I’m using her as an example of why the benefit system isn’t as bad as the posters on here make out

                and for the record I’d agree to the govt to hire people (and pay them accordingly) to specifically target companies that don’t pay their taxes

                    2. 23.2.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.2

                      You mean bennie-like too lazy and indolent to get on with peeling those spuds aye Piss ? Sitting on your bellicose arse waiting for others to do it all for you ?

                      Sad for Mrs Piss-Ford if those scummy no-pay Maccers people missed the Maccers sweet-and-sour dipping sauce.

                    1. 23.2.1.1.1.1.1.1.2.1

                      The boundary changes. Some NAT MPs might be fucked off. That on top of low internal polling might have some people quietly counting numbers in their heads.

                2. 23.2.1.1.1.1.1.2

                  I’m using her as an example of why the benefit system isn’t as bad as the posters on here make out

                  You’re using an anecdote. The thousands that are getting pushed off benefits and generally being screwed over tell a different story.

              1. 23.2.1.1.1.2.1

                http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/industries/9421266/Economy-set-to-beat-global-growth-OECD

                “The economy is set to grow 3.6 per cent next year, putting New Zealand in the top six developed countries according to an OECD report.

                The forecast rate would put New Zealand well above the OECD average of 2.4 per cent forecast for next year, and ahead of Australia on 2.7 per cent.”

                – Another reason why National will be returned to power and why there’ll be another series of “why didn’t the people vote for Labour” on this site after the election

                    1. 23.2.1.1.1.2.1.1.1.1

                      Aha, greed and posing. “It’s all about my penis substitute!” Compensating much? I’ve been told that style matters more than size, though the two are hardly exclusive.

                    3. 23.2.1.1.1.2.1.1.1.3

                      “Working on it” aye Piss ?

                      Like mounting the engine a la Bowel Motion ?

                      What sort of ShonKey Python cargo-cult is this Piss ?

                      Grend Vitara to Maori Land Bruiser ?

                      How asprayshinal !

                  1. 23.2.1.1.1.2.1.2.1

                    When life gives Christchurch lemons National makes a three term government or something like that…you gotta play the cards that you’re dealt much

                    1. 23.2.1.1.1.2.1.2.1.1

                      And there we see just how much empathy chris73 really has – an earthquake is simply a political opportunity. Let us all thank him for his honesty, though his idols might be embarrassed.

            3. 23.2.1.1.1.3

              It’s not a decent car, you moron. It’s a heap of shit full of problems. As with many sales pitches, the reality didn’t meet the ashprishun.

              1. 23.2.1.1.1.3.1

                7000 grand can buy you a decent car but when your requirements for a decent are: purple paint job and (I’m assuming) rims then you probably will be dissappointed

                But doesn’t change the fact she could afford a 7 grand car on what the government gives her so well done National for being so generous 🙂

        2. 23.2.1.2

          Right debating points: try to bash bennies as bludgers and try to divert attention away from the real bludgers who siphon off way more of taxpayers money.

    3. 23.3

      There was nothing in that article that said she was on a benefit. And besides, she could have been working part time, and scrimped and saved, begged and burrowed.

      And anyway, if the dealer is going to sell an unwarranted car to someone, then it speaks more about him than anyone else.

      My father has been a car dealer for 40-odd years, and he has never sold a car that was unwarranted to anyone.

      1. 23.3.1

        Stuff edited the web page after it had gone up but the story was in the Chch Press and it said she was a solo mum on a benefit

  25. 25

    Colin Craig goes supermarket shopping on Campbell Live … oh dear. Wants a higher tax on alcohol as well! (Nats spin doctors groan …)

    If he’s National’s lifeline, they’re dead and buried.

          1. 25.1.1.1.1

            another right wing diversion.

            Len hasn’t campaigned on his religion.

            Neither it seems is Craig – Craig just like to seem a bit of an anti-fun ascetic – frugal and abstemious.

                  1. 25.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1

                    She’s 80. So you’re prone to gerontophiliac fantasies? That’s too much information, really. Nobody wants to know about your sexual perversions.

                    2. 25.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.2

                      Ooh, homophobia! How quaint! FWIW, I’m both straight and taken, sorry.

                      So why do you masturbate while thinking about an 80-year old woman you’ve never met? You are one sick puppy, I have to say. If I had any perversions like yours, I wouldn’t advertise them.

                    4. 25.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.4

                      Well, I just got “chris73” with his rape fantasy to show what rape culture is – it’s all about shaming people – both the women who are victims and the men who are the “owners” of women. His weird, perverted fantasy about raping my elderly mother shows just what he and his ilk practise.

                      Sorry ropata, I’m not going to watch that video. I know too many rape victims and trigger warnings apply to me too.

            2. 25.1.1.1.1.2

              Don’t forget the Weirdo’s supported by Best Bling Rankin. That should make all the difference to the price of Weetbix. Yay, God’s World is saved !

          2. 25.1.1.1.2

            I know plenty of real Christians, the kind who practise what they preach – love. Craig is full of hate doused in grease.

          3. 25.1.1.1.3

            Debate using reason and evidence.
            Don’t insult, use slogans, distract or derail.
            Time for bed, I sense.
            I know youngsters able to debate using less puerile arguments.

      2. 25.1.2

        “a gifted seat”

        As long as National think that’s what it will be, I’m very happy.

        (A little research on Epsom pre-2011 would be a good idea, but hey I’m not here to help).

      3. 25.1.3

        And goodbye to our sexual and social freedoms.

        Pogrom for gays, first on the list.
        Next burning books on evolution.
        Banning holding hands in our schools.

        We should all be worried.

  26. 26

    Watching TV3. Can’t believe the stupid Campbell Live programme on nonentity Crazy Colin shopping for broccoli and his ‘greetings card ‘philosophies’.

    What a waste of TV time. Unbelievable that this person could be remotely regarded as one of our ‘leaders’. I thought Banks was about as low as we could get in idiocy but I was wrong.

    It was like a Jon Stewart parody on Fox News or a Stewart joke based on Toronto’s experience
    but they were serious1
    Campbell tried unsuccessfully to mask his contempt for Craig but he and the camera people must be so ashamed of presenting us with this rubbish TV. .At least Gower wasn’t involved but still a new low in TV!

        1. 26.2.1.1

          A regular little Martha Stewart. Like Brian Edwards’ bestie Michelle Boag who some months ago on Mora’s Flanel waxed long about her devilishly clever $1.59 purchase of half a head of cauliflower. Lasted three meals !

        2. 26.2.2.2

          Sure, some will.

          But National’s plan is (apparently) to parachute Craig in, so he becomes a Nat-substitute. So then he wouldn’t be a fringe candiadate, but a “mainstream” 50 percenter.

          When/if there’s a post on all this, I’ll list Top Ten ways that Gower is wrong – and Epsom is not a model that can easily be followed. Too busy right now.

    3. 26.3

      In America, they need parodists like John Stewart and Steven Colbert… in New Zealand, Colon Craig Rat Boy and Banks seem to render parody redundant… but in fact they make it more necessary.

  27. 27

    I understand the Boundaries Commission have released the new boundaries.
    I heard something on radio as a comment and it was suggesting that Bennets seat was to be combined with Upper Harbour. Cannot find anything on line about this. Anyone have more details

  28. 28

    I did but cannot see any thing about the announcement. I would have thought the Electoral Commission would have it on their web site its of interest to quite a few people I would have thought. But nothing there nothing on TV3 or NZ Herald or Stuff
    Someone must have the details but where?

    1. 28.1

      Ron, scroll up the Open Mike page. There’s a link to the 3 News report on it. [22.1.1.1]. It’s not going to be announced officially til tomorrow. 3 News leaked it tonight. they are the only source.

      2. 28.1.2

        Thanks should have scrolled up further. AS I am in East Coast Bays electorate it might prove interesting either way. Think I would emigrate if Craig wins this seat. Oh well back on street campaigning for me

    2. 28.2

      Mate apparently the boundary changes were leaked to Patrick Gower today (which is interesting in itself). I imagine the official announcement will still be made tomorrow by the Electoral Commission.

      1. 28.2.1

        Yes. It seemed like a Nat leak as all the focus was on Craig and National. Probably trying to prepare the way for McCully to move on & Craig to move in.

        There should have been more focus on Labour’s options – so the coverage was telling.

        1. 28.2.1.1

          If you’re correct and the boundary changes were leaked to Gower by the PMO, presumably as a way of furthering the narrative they’re trying to build around Craig’s electoral prospects next year (when the reality is that the new Auckland seat is most likely Labour leaning and not really suitable for Craig) then that is pretty shabby politics. You’d like too hope that the Electoral Commission can get on and do its work without politics and spin interfering.

      2. 28.2.2

        BTW, the new Kelston electorate, carves a slice out of Cumliffe’s Cunliffe’s New Lynn electorate. How will that impact on his vote?

        1. 28.2.2.1

          I think New Lynn gains labour leaning neighbourhoods of what is now Waitakere. You might want to check spelling of Mr Cunliffe’s name Karol?

  29. 29

    Alternate realities. The NZ news is all All Whites, live blogs. Sommet Sports had Germany and…. someone. Now I think they have France and Ukraine.

  30. 30

    What a great effort from All Whites 3-1 down and managed to get another one. Great comeback. It seemed that everyone expected Mexico to do well despite them having had a dip recently. The crowd were loving it. Sounds like it was a good game to watch.

  31. 31

    3 degrees of insanity, is Paula Bennett appearing on my TV decrying the rack renting ‘holiday park’ in Her electorate,

    What exactly does this abysmal Minister think happens when the State in the guise of the National Government She is a Minister in sells off State Houses by the 100 and only replaces 30 of every 100 they flick off,

    The ‘rack renters’ move in, that’s what happens…

      1. 31.1.1

        Tents? Pah! Try cardboard boxes. (But with a waxy coating to make them a bit more waterproof – we wouldn’t want to be mean to poor people).

      2. 31.1.2

        They found in Arizona that tents were quite satisfactory for housing their unpopular malefactors. The people in the State love it, or at least some vocal ones. The rest can’t make themselves heard. And I think it is a lot cheaper, and that is what matters to those whose minds, ethics and standards have been gained by readings from mail order catalogues and supermarket brochures and of course watching well-groomed horses neighing on television.

  33. 33

    Anyone know where the Geranium Lady, the useless TV gardening show one, where she sits in all of this ? Maybe ShonKey’ll jack up gifting her safe Tory seat to the Weirdo ?

    For the good of “the party” you understand.

  34. 34

    North
    You may as well prattle children’s rhymes about the geranium lady, just replace Mary with Maggie.

    Wikipedia says this version dates from 1744 so the matters exercising our minds and enthusing our actions continue down the ages.
    Mistress Mary, Quite contrary,
    How does your garden grow?
    With Silver Bells, And Cockle Shells,
    And so my garden grows.[1]

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