Open mike 11/10/2020

Written By: notices and features - Date published: - 82 comments
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82 comments on “Open mike 11/10/2020”

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  1. 1

    This time next week, we will see if the polls are right, and if we have the first majority by left wing parties since Labour/Alliance/Green back in 1999.

    1. 3.1

      What stands out in Mau's piece is the stuff about Seymour.

      The getting rid of interest free student loans is just part of their philosophical vi=ew of education

      Education, learning, schooling is a commodity, a personal thing not a community goal.

      Everyone runs around do their own thing and I guess being rid of rules and restriction will allow 'freedom' of operation.

      When he is PM or Deputy after the 2023 election will part of the coalition deal be dependent on Act getting its way with education?

      1. 3.1.1

        ACT's 8% polling tells us that as many as one fifth of the people normally hidden away inside National's 40%-plus nationwide support are nutters, keen to return us to circa 1987 and an orgy of lawless opportunism for the benefit of the wealthy.

        1. 3.1.1.1

          Yep. ACT under Seymour are a 0.64% party in normal times. These aren't normal times.

          The most horrifying policy (and there are a few) is the roll back of gun laws. Does he not get that the reason the Australian white supremacist chose NZ was because our gun laws were slack?

          1. 3.1.1.1.1

            Circa 1987 going on 1887 – we are instituting systems and attitudes that our grandies, our ancestors, sailed away from Britain hoping to get away from. We are stuck in that mud in our gumboots, fast losing the higher learning, the intellectual thought once aimed for, and getting into limited farming mindset with accompanying absentee landowner/lords and housing speculator/lords and rentiers.

            We need to step out of our gumboots, abandon them, and squish our way painfully to a grassy knoll somewhere where we can get some prominence, view our sorry state, and have a pow-wow about fixing on a new path and the new ways we have to adopt.

            1. 3.1.1.1.1.1

              Capitalism was highly rampant in New Zealand in the 1800's. Hardly getting away from it by coming here. Fundamentally New Zealand was being exploited not being built into some sort of benevolent utopia.

        2. 3.1.1.2

          I predict ACT's share of the overall vote will fall short of 8%. In fact it could drop down to 5% or slightly less. I base that on some 2 to 3% are perennial National voters who will switch back to National at the last minute. They will feel obliged to, especially if it continues to look like National is going to bomb-out big time and it likely will.

          I sincerely hope they do because that disparate bunch of ultra-right wing candidates Seymour brings with him are dangerous.

          1. 3.1.1.2.1

            Oh, don't predict that, Anne. One of the things I'm really looking forward to (apart from a Labour/Greens coalition) is Seymour desperately trying to control his disparate bunch!

            I predict some spectacular implosions in the coming term!
            Entertainment better than the movies!

            1. 3.1.1.2.1.1

              So very true. Never thought of that. There's a good chance they might start brandishing ak24s around the place.

              Nah… its alright officer, I was only kidding. 😮

        1. 3.1.2.1

          Kind of hard to see how this would happen. If National get their shit together, find a popular leader and get back into the mid-40% range by 2023, I don't see Act staying at 7-8%, and certainly not getting even higher. National will want those voters back for themselves.

    1. 4.1

      Obituary? Fuck no, way too soon for that.

      I'm not considering any obituaries until he's filled with silver bullets and wooden stakes in his crypt, completely encased in garlic, then a Chernobyl-grade concrete casing and sarcophagus structure around the lot.

      nb: I'm not suggesting anyone attempt to do any of this, I'm just outlining what would be needed for me to feel reassured he's not gonna rise again to haunt us.

    2. 4.2

      I think it would be more accurate to say that this will be his last election campaign.

      Whatever happens this time next week, I doubt that he would have it in him to have another go in 2023.

        1. 4.2.1.1

          He could take over the NZ1st Trust and rename it the Winston Peters Foundation (We Say Nuh-Uh To Whatever Helen's Foundation Says)

    3. 4.3

      Winston (at 78 approximately?) will be the most sought after commentator on TV for the 2023 election. He will love it because he will be able to settle old scores with impunity.

      2. 4.3.2

        Settle old scores with impunity? He's got old scores with a helluva lot of people but I didn't realise impunity was one! smiley

  5. 5

    Am on the unpublished roll and this election was the first time I was mailed an 'easy vote card', yay 🙂 Thanks electoral commission, that was less of a mission than last time.

  6. 6

    edit
    Some questions for our minds if they are hazy about joining the ones who are trying, (to do better), that Nick Drake thought up.

    (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gfYnXGV8PfM&list=PLGBNU27l6atWt7gZYiln3taPdwcdky_FR&index=1

    Hazey Jane I

    Do you curse where you come from?
    Do you swear in the night?
    Will it mean much to you
    If I treat you right?
    Do you like what you’re doing?
    Would you do it some more?
    Or will you stop once and wonder
    What you’re doing it for?
    Hey slow, Jane, make sense
    Slow, slow, Jane, cross the fence

    Do you feel like a remnant
    Of something that’s past?
    Do you find things are moving
    Just a little too fast?
    Do you hope to find new ways
    Of quenching your thirst?
    Do you hope to find new ways of doing
    Better than your worst?
    Hey slow, Jane, let me prove
    Slow, slow, Jane, we’re on the move

    Do it for you
    Sure that you would do the same for me one day
    So try to be true
    Even if it’s only in your hazey way

    Can you tell if you’re moving
    With no mirror to see?
    If you’re just riding a new man
    Looks a little like me?
    Is it all so confusing?
    Is it hard to believe?
    When the winter is coming can you
    Sign up and leave
    Hey slow, Jane, clear your eye
    Slow, slow, Jane, fly on by

    On the Sunday after the election we might be listening and thinking as in Hazey Jane II of Nick Drake's.

    (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lCaDp1gb6D4&list=RDC7QLtMHOiqw&index=7

    Hazey Jane II

    And what will happen in the morning when the world it gets so crowded that you can’t look out the
    window in the morning?

    And what will happen in the evening in the forest with the weasel with the teeth that bite so sharp when you’re not looking in the evening?

    And all the friends that you once knew are left behind they kept you safe and so secure amongst the books and all the records of your lifetime?

    What will happen
    In the morning
    When the world it gets so crowded that you can’t look out the window in the morning

    Hey, take a little while to grow your brothers hair
    And now, take a little while to make your sister fair
    And now that the family is part of a chain
    Take off your eyeshade start over again

    Now take a little while to find your way in here
    Now take a little while to make your story clear
    Now that you’re lifting
    Your feet from the ground
    Weigh up your anchor
    And never look ‘round

    Let’s sing a song
    For Hazey Jane
    She’s back again in my mind

    If songs were lines
    In a conversation

    The situation would be fine

    http://www.nickdrake.com/hazey_jane_II_lyrics.html

  8. 8

    On Winston, Thanks for showing the convoluted use of Tax Havens by some.

    Thanks for the Gold Card.

    Thanks for choosing Jacinda over Bill.

    If this is the end of your political career, I am sure you will be like Michael Cullen, serving to the end.

    1. 8.1

      If he goes, then the last link that Parliament has with the pre-Rogernomics era goes.

      This is being overlooked amid the schadenfrude.

    2. 8.2

      Winston, Thanks for showing the convoluted use of Tax Havens by some.

      That was Peters’ biggest contribution to NZ society imo. He fronted the Winebox saga at a time when no-one else had the guts to stick their heads above the parapet. Sure, they did their best to cut his head off for the next 10 years (Michelle Boag was prominent in that effort) but they never succeeded. All the principle culprits were forced to flee NZ and go hide in Switzerland.

      None of them were prosecuted even though the evidence proved beyond reasonable doubt they were guilty as sin. An excellent example of how there are strict rules for us ordinary folk and none for the rich and powerful – and their lackeys.

      1. 8.2.1

        And Winston has been just as involved in the financial chicanery as all the other politicians. He is donkey deep in it.

        2. 8.2.1.2

          That has yet to be proven in a court of law….You are making sweeping generalisations. The Serious Fraud Squad said no pollies.. but don't let that stop the smears.

  9. 9

    What happens if huge numbers of Nats vote strategically: party vote ACT, electorate vote National?

    Could an overhang result in, say, 41 National electorate seats (same as now) and 20 ACT seats?

      1. 9.1.1

        Probably not but let's say NAT+ACT gets 44% total. In the scenario described above ACT gets 17% (20 seats) and NAT 27% but 41 electorate seats, a 9 seat overhang.

        It all gets a bit complicated with the redistributed vote but the right seems so crazy and angry at the moment (more than usual) they might just vote ACT in those numbers.

          1. 9.1.1.1.1

            I've got an ancient garden rake which goes back to the days when they made the things of iron. Would that be lethal enough?

        2. 9.1.1.2

          But if there's a 9-seat overhang – ie a 129-member Parliament? – then 61 MPs isn't a majority: Labour and Greens would presumably have 68 MPs? (or in fact in that case ACT’s 17% would earn 22 seats (with Nats’ 41, totalling 63), but Lab-Greens would still have 66?).

          But yes this isn’t going to happen.

    1. 10.1

      "No" voters never seem to directly address the question WHY they think someone should be arrested for using cannabis, which seems to be the key issue here.

      1. 10.1.1

        Not that I care if it goes through, I am pushing it to think people still get arrested for smoking a joint these days, unless it is an excuse to get them in for other shit they have listed against their name.

    1. 11.1

      How many times now has National got the numbers wrong?

      A bit like rugby- they keep dropping the ball, in their own half…….

      1. 11.1.1

        I’ve lost count but the 2020-list must be getting as long as BLiP’s world-famous list of John Key and National’s lies. And John was the Leader for nine long years; I can’t see Judith lasting even nine months.

  13. 13

    Interesting – great historic rugby pictures have ended up in USA? hands. That's capitalism for you, get their hands on anything that is regarded as important, which raises the price, and sell it on the international collectors market. We can have our own taonga back if we can pay the price.

    But we don't know what is important to us and make sure we treasure it till we see it in foreigners' hands. Babies we are.

    https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/428057/online-auction-sells-rare-new-zealand-rugby-pictures

  14. 14

    The rugby test has a moral for politicians in the final week before an election. The try is not scored until the ball has been placed with downwards pressure on the ground on or over the try line. It needs more then fancy haircuts, aka slogans, personalities aka political reputations, and distractions like arguing with the ref aka media-watching.

    It's not just a game. It's us and our lives.

      1. 15.1.1

        It was on 3 news

        They haven't posted it yet given the current bias, but the bloke was walking round seeing tumble weeds.

        Apparently his party gathering had about 20 supporters

  16. 16

    I want to stop the wealth tax so will vote labour to help keep the greens out of the next government. Reminds me of Clark's aversion to them. Good foresight.

  17. 17

    Voted today.

    Greens party vote ,

    Labour electorate ( not that that matters out here in blue country)

    Yes and yes in the referendum s.

    I really wanted to vote top but james the commenter scared me to the greens , we need more labour , they ain't perfect but the nacts are fucking scary .

  18. 18

    The Prime Minister today said she wants there to be no social housing waiting list by 2030.

    A laudable goal.

    But I'd like to counter that by saying I'd like for there to be no need for social housing at all by 2050.

    That is, a socio-economic system working as it should where everyone is able to live and house themselves comfortably without struggle.

    1. 18.1

      How would it work with no social housing at all? Everyone has to be either a rent-slave to a private landlord or a mortgage-slave to a bank until they finally become one of the exalted few that are mortgage-free?

      What happens with those few that really don't seem to be able to fit themselves into the regular societal housing paradigm, such as swordfish's parents' neighbour? Contract out housing them to Serco?

    2. 18.2

      Yes. A simple solution when looked at objectively. We don't mind going Back to the Future with sensible goals which include the citizenry having a say and helping the build.

    1. 19.1

      We could have a day without Trump or the USA even being mentioned now and then. When in NZ do as the Kiwis do, is a slogan for the odd day.

    2. 19.2

      Seeing as the gag in itself isn't actually so bad, as far as such gags go, and Trump could certainly count on camera crews and editing to make up for the fact that he would probably look more than a bit hapless doing it in real life, I can only imagine that he decided against it because he is currently either too weak or too uncoordinated to rip a shirt off reliably.

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